My first guess, and the apparent reason for doing this is simple. Russian trains can currently run right into Finland, and this change will stop that route of invasion.
“Finland’s track gauge is the same as Russia’s was in the late 19th and early 20th century— 1,524mm — which is 89mm wider than the European standard.”
Lol, there is one track running over the border, it’s super easy for us to disrupt that.
As the other commenter said, being EU compatible is by far the largest reason.
That, and our far-right government trying to shift attention away from their failures, with not enough money in the coffers to justify it.
Oh and look what the same transport minister said just over a year ago about the Helsinki-Tallinn tunnel (about the only thing that would make a gauge change prudent):
On 8 February 2024, Finnish Minister of Transport and Communications Lulu Ranne told Estonian daily Postimees that the tunnel is “unrealistic” and not on the agenda of the government, with the project remaining on hold unless further funding is provided by the European Union.
That was before their ratings went down.
Also changing axes at the border takes a bit of time but isn’t that complicated. trains have been operated between the Russian system and other countries in the former warsaw pact with that switch in track width for a long time.
Russia is really good at building military train tracks. They are totally capable of building another one right into your rail network
Probably more being prepared for Rail Baltica. Building a tunnel from Talinn to Helsinki has been talked about for some time, which would create an actually busy rail connection to another country with standard gauge. Currently there is only one, which is with Sweden along the Baltic coast. That however is so far north, that few people use it, so it does not matter.
Gauge can be changed rather quickly, if need be. That happend in WW2 between Germany and the Soviets depending on where the front was.
It doesn’t matter much, changing bogies is a relatively quick and easy task, they could use that money better for other defense development.
The Russian military recognized as early as 1841 that operations to disrupt railway track did not depend on the gauge, and should instead focus on destroying bridges and tunnels
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/5_ft_and_1520_mm_gauge_railways
Just a sentence further on:
However, in both World Wars the break of gauge did pose some amount of obstacle to the invading Germans.
And of course there’s another good reason: Compatibility with the rest of the EU. Notably, the proposed Helsinki-Tallinn tunnel is supposed to have standard gauge because Rail Baltica has.
I don’t think they’ll do it in one go, though, makes much more sense to do it, mostly, at natural infrastructure replacement speed. Tracks need new sleepers and new rails every so often, the trackbed needs renovation (though narrowing of course is easier than widening), you might want to upgrade the speed rating of the lines. Each of those is an opportunity to do this kind of thing for essentially free, modulo having to deal with the different gauges on your network.
Tanks and jets also pose some amount of obstacle, and they may have a better roi.
Until the Helsinki Talllin tunnel is built it doesn’t make a lot of sense.
OK, I did not know that. FWIW trains run fine here and they are modern. Changing the tracks of the entire country is a - I can’t even guess how many billion project. Meanwhile our current conservative-to-far-right coalition is slashing social security from all sides, and the statistics are not in favor.
So I can’t say I’m a big fan of this right now.
Oh look, the transport minister is one of those nazis in sheep’s clothing.
I hope they get the criticism they deserve, because the timing is clearly chosen to shift attention away from their failures.
Spain uses high speed trains on standard gauge next to slower trains on Iberian gauge, which is also wide. That would be a good way to do it for Finland. Built the Talinn-Helsiniki tunnel and then a standard gauge high speed rail line from Helsinki-Tampere-Oulu as a bases and then it becomes much easier to just change gauge on the slower lines.
The project is backed by multiple ministers and has the support of other Nordic transport ministers, it’s in cooperation with NATO, and the EU will pay for half the project and do 30% of the work. It’s also several years away from being close to starting.
And it has absolutely zero to do with how the trains run or how modern they are, it’s about making a new connection to the rest of Europe for ease of defense. It’s not just about cutting off Russia, it’s about getting tanks and such in by train. As well as having a commercial connection to strengthen trade.
You literally sound like a Russian disinformation actor who wants to hold Finland back.
I’m not against it. They literally said that it’s time to start working on it now, and that’s just wrong. And you literally sound like someone who has no clue about Finnish politics.
As you can probably sense from my replies, I’m directly affected by the cuts this government imposed on all forms of social/health security. And to distract from their deserved dip in polling, they now make a big announcement that is bound to evoke reactions like yours.
The “Russian threat” part of the narrative is exactly what these assholes are riding on (and as others pointed out numerous times in this thread, one of the last reasons for these changes) and you swallow it, because it’s the only thing you know about this area.
Finland has had a land border with a totalitarian, militaristic and expansionist country for 100 years. There’s a constant threat that we constantly deal with (I mean the government/military, not the populace), and train tracks really are the smallest part of it.
Sheesh.
Please remove the insult, thanks.
OK, removed. However; calling me a Russian disinformation actor is insulting, too.
@mriswith@lemmy.world It would indeed be great if you could avoid throwing around such accusations. There surely is a time & a place for such but …
- From my outsider’s POV, I don’t know if I agree with the argument that this is just a diversion measure. However, politicians regularly perform media-attention sleight of hand of that sort, so it’s imo at least a somewhat credible argument.
- If you do notice a pattern, it would be great if you could DM this mod account first.
Thanks!
(This comment written by federal reverse, not anzo.)
The answer is in the first few words of the article, “Finland’s track gauge is the same as Russia’s was in the late 19th and early 20th century— 1,524mm — which is 89mm wider than the European standard.”
So again, why is it that you oppose this change?
deleted by creator
Actually Russian gauge is not 1524mm, but 1520mm! Finland has unique gauge not used anywhere else in the World, although that 4mm difference allows most bogies to be compatible with both of them, international trains can run through the border without bogie exchange.
So the point of the article is right, butnot perfect in details. I love trains.
However, as the text says “early 20th century”, 1524 mm was the nominal gauge of soviet/russian railways until the 1970s.
There was no question in my comment. The answer to your question is in my comment. It really isn’t that hard to understand.
Finland doesn’t have much of a rail network, and the only international connection over land used to be to St Petersburg. If Estonia & Sweden & the big ferry companies are on board it would be nice to change gauge evtl., to have freight waggons come across the ferries.
But I don’t like that our practically failed government uses this to raise its prestige while every statistic shows that their stupid austerity measures a) save way too little money and b) fuck up the country and its people.
So when our far-right anti-social government says “now is the right time for Finland to start work on changing the gauge” I disagree.
There is also a rail connection with Sweden, which use standard gauge.
Anyway the work would start 2030 at the earliest. So this is an announcment of creating plans to do it, which is cheap.
I too agree this might not be worth the investment, although I don’t know how many connections there are with Sweden, Norway and the rest of EU by ferry.
None! Partly because of geography, partly, I guess, precisely because of this difference. Would be nice to see more freight trains instead of trucks coming from the ferries but again, this government has systematically fucked over the little people to save a few hundred million euros, I’d like them to fix that first thankyouverymuch.
Currently, they are planning a tunnel from Helsinki to Tallinn.
This tunnel is basically a meme and I will believe it when I see it.
Oh and look what the same transport minister said just over a year ago:
On 8 February 2024, Finnish Minister of Transport and Communications Lulu Ranne told Estonian daily Postimees that the tunnel is “unrealistic” and not on the agenda of the government, with the project remaining on hold unless further funding is provided by the European Union.
That was before their ratings went down.
I doubt this will happen. Given the length of Finland’s railways, going from Helsinki all the way to the Arctic Circle, it would be prohibitively expensive, and the money would have better uses.
If they’re fearing a Russian invasion, a more cost-effective mitigation would be the Swiss approach: preemptively mine railway lines/bridges/tunnels with explosives.
Spain has an even longer railway net and consecutively changes the sleepers to ones allowing the change to European standard gauge as well.
Also Spains high speed rail network is standard gauge already and not Iberian gauge.
Yay!
